sure its permanency. This Government, he said, was formed by the people; it was made for the benefit of all, and not a few, who may obtain offices under it; and it is to the people composing the Government that you are to look in time of danger to the militia of the States and of the United States; and, so long as you retain this Government in its original purity, just so long will it be supported and defended by the people; but whenever you abandon these principles the people will abandon you. Sir, you never can look to any other source for the protection and defence of this Government. You have looked to the people heretofore in times of war, or difficulty, and danger, and you never have looked to them in vain, and I venture nothing when I say you never will look to them in vain.

He said he would not inquire into the capacity of the country to support such an army as we now had, for that was not the proper inquiry to be made. He said the proper inquiry on this subject was, whether or not such an army was necessary for the good of the country in time of peace? Nor would he inquire what was to be the situation of those who were to be disbanded from the service in the event the reduction he proposed should be made. He went on the ground that the Government should retain no person in service, in any office, that was entirely unnecessary. When it became necessary the Government had a right to call into its service any individual, indeed every one, and none should be retained longer than their services were necessary. Because some of the officers of the Army would be left out of the public employment, and would be thrown into a worse situation than they now enjoy, is not an argument with me sufficient to retain this expensive and useless establishment. Had this reduction been made at the time he always thought it ought to have been made on the return of peace-or even afterwards, when he himself had proposed it, we should have avoided the state of things that we are now compelled to meet the resort to loans, Treasury notes, or taxes; neither of which he, for one, was willing to adopt. His course of policy, in times of peace, he said, was to retrench the expenditures until he brought them entirely within the means of the revenue of the country. This he would do, not only by reducing the Army, but there were other establishments also, on which he would retrench, and some of which he would abolish. He alluded to the Military Academy at West Point, in the State of New York, on which the Government had already expended millions of money for the benefit of a few favorites of the most wealthy of our country.

Mr. Chairman, we all know that an individual, a citizen, a planter, or farmer, of your country, who expends largely every year over and above the amount he really makes, is in the broad road to ruin and bankruptcy, and so it is with a government. I can perceive no difference, more especially during a time of peace and tranquillity, when, instead of running more and more in debt, as we have done, we ought to be endeavoring, as speedily as possible, to pay off the public debts

MARCH, 1820.

we have already incurred during a state of war. But, Mr. C. said while he entered his most solemn protest against the doctrine of standing armies, in time of peace, he would also beg leave to say, that he had entertained some doubts and fears respecting the course of policy we were pursuing in regard to our Navy. He had, he said, in common not only with the members of Congress, but also with the people of the whole United States, yielded to the impulse which had been given (and which, he believed, was yet in a great degree felt) by the many gallant and glorious achievements which had been acquired by that species of our force during the late war. So great was its influence at that time, that he believed there was not a single individual in Congress, and he knew of none anywhere else who raised their voice against a rapid increase of the Navy. He said he himself had given his voice most cordially in favor of the measure appropriating eight millions to the increase of the Navy, to be applied to its increase at the rate of one million each year. But, since then, he had often been led to doubt the policy of the course that he himself, as well as others, had pursued in regard to our Navy, which he believed, to a certain extent, would always be found useful to the country.

He said he most decidedly concurred with the honorable gentleman from Georgia, (Mr. COBB,) in some of the views he took while speaking on this subject yesterday; he feared we were increasing the establishment too rapidly. He thought it probably would have been better in the end, if the application of this eight millions to the increase of the navy had been more gradual. He said he was not now opposed to the amount that was appropriated; he was in favor of that sum at that time, and was yet; but he thought, if, instead of applying it in eight years, as was then determined on, it had been applied to the same object in twelve or sixteen years, it would have been better. He rather thought that five hundred thousand dollars a year would have been sufficient to keep pace with the wealth and population of our country. But, said he, in making these remarks, I must not be understood to be in the slightest degree opposed to this establishment, or to its increase in such way as is commensurate with the means of our country. This would be my course of policy. The other course which we have all been pursuing, is, I fear, to result in the most fatal consequences. Its rapid increase will soon bring it to that size which would make it burdensome to the nation, and a permanent system of taxation must then be resorted to in order to support it. This, he believed, would not be borne by the people very cheerfully in times of peace, however willing they are to bear any burdens in time of war. Nor, sir, said he, am I prepared to say that the people of the United States ought to submit to great burdens of taxation in times of peace, to keep up an overgrown and expensive establishment of any kind for defence in time of war. He thought the people of the United States ought to look to themselves, as their own defenders, and their country's defenders too, in time of war. He thought that any course of policy

that was calculated to draw the attention of the people to a regular standing army or a navy, as a force to be entirely relied on for defence in time of war, was a dangerous and unsafe policy, contrary to the very principles of our government, and ought never to be attempted to be held out to the people. The Government, he said, was formed for the benefit of the people; therefore, its preservation and defence must rest in their hands; and while he always admitted the utility of a navy, and even a regular army, as an auxiliary force, he never had viewed either, or both combined together, to be sufficient to be considered the main reliance for defence.

Sir, said, he, my course of policy, as regards the regular army, is to retain in service as few as possible during a state of peace. Indeed, I believe we could do without any much better than we could with an overgrown, expensive establishment of this kind, notwithstanding I am willing to retain as much of the army as is necessary to occupy those forts and garrisons or fortifications, where our arms and munitions of war ought to be kept and taken care of. I myself am induced to believe that three thousand, properly distributed and properly kept employed, would be amply sufficient for this purpose. But I am, however, willing to retain five thousand, in order to conform to the views of other gentlemen, whose experience and information on this subjuct is much greater than my own; and I believe it is not in the power of any gentleman to show that a greater number than five thousand is at all necessary in time of peace.

Sir, said he, I cannot give in to the doctrine that we must keep up this regular army of ten thousand in time of peace, in order to acquire or keep up military science. I think it would be better, and a much more correct course of policy for us to pursue, if we undertake to teach military science, and to expend this enormous amount of money for that object, that we should expend it amongst the militia officers of the United States, where the science they might acquire at public expense would be diffused through the whole mass of the people, which cannot nor will not be the case by retaining your regular army. Heretofore the General Government has paid but little attention to the militia. Indeed, it may be said they have been almost entirely neglected: no moneys have been expended to teach them military science, nor will it be done, as I believe, so long as this regular army is made the peculiar favorite on which we determine to expend so much of the public money.

He said he did not like to see the growth of a regular army fostered and cherished by his country, in the manner it had been. He referred to the extent of that army in the year 1803, and compared it with what it is at this time, from which, he said, we might readily estimate its growth in time to come; for, said he, we may expect often to be threatened with wars, and sometimes to be actually involved in war with some of the various foreign Powers with whom we have intercourse; and, if every war is to leave this burden on us, of an increased regular army, to be supported in peace, 16th CoN. 1st SESS.-51

H. OF R.

we may soon expect our Government to leave entirely its first principles, and become as expensive and oppressive as the Governments of Europe; and, rest assured, sir, said he, that, in the same proportion that you increase the burdens on the people, even though you may do it under the pretence of its being necessary for their good, or for their safety, in the same degree you will destroy that zealous attachment and devotion to the Government which has been so eminently displayed in many sections of the United States, during the late contest we have had with a foreign Power. I lay it down as a correct principle, that that Government which secures to its citizens liberty and independence on the cheapest terms is the best, and always will be held in the highest estimation by the superior intelligence of the people of this country. It will always secure to itself the attachment of the people; and, however necessary government has been found, it is only good to a certain extent, and too much of it is worse than none.

Sir, said he, I very much regret to see so manifest a disposition in favor of a regular army. It was calculated, he feared to prevent any retrenchment on this establishment, also to prevent any thing being done to give arms or discipline to the militia, on which force he would always rely for the preservation of our Government. He did not wish to induce the people of the United States to look to any other force for defence or protection; he wished every man to consider himself the protector and defender of his country; for such, he believed, were some of the principles on which our Government had been formed, and such were the principles he wished to see cherished and preserved.

Mr. Chairman, said he, in deciding what ought to be the extent of the regular army in time of peace, I will not look at all to a state of war, because, in such a state of affairs, any regular army we could have would be entirely incompetent to the defence of the country, however much reliance might be placed on it. I am unwilling to rely on it myself, and I know the people of my country are unwilling to trust their liberty to any force of that description. They think it much safer to take the weapons of war into their own hands, when it becomes necessary, and become their own, as well as their country's defenders.

These, sir, said he, are some of the views which I entertain on this subject; and, fully aware of every feeling that would always be excited on a subject of its kind and importance, he said he had felt it his duty to submit the proposition to the consideration of the House, fully impressed with the most thorough conviction that the policy and interest of our country requires its adoption.

Mr. CLAY avowed himself to be in favor of reducing the Army, in preference to resorting to taxes, loans, or to an invasion of the Sinking Fund, to meet the expenses of the Governmentif, on the report of the Committee of Foreign Relations, the attitude of the country should not be changed to that of war, or to that which menace war. Meanwhile, he was disposed not to act on the bill now before the Committee, but to defer it

for the present, for the purpose of acting on the military appropriation bill. If, after the report of the Committee on Foreign Relations should be made, it should be thought expedient to reduce the Army, the appropriations would shape themselves to what should be the actual force and condition of the Military Establishment. He therefore moved to lay this bill on the table, with a view to take up the appropriation bill.

The question was taken on this motion without debate, and decided in the affirmative.

The bill making appropriations for the support of the Military Establishment, for the current year, was then taken up.

On coming to the appropriation for the support of the Military Acadamy for the present year.

Mr. CANNON spoke at some length against this appropriation, on the ground of hostility to the institution itself; conceiving that the money levied by taxes on the people, and on the poor as well as the rich, could be better employed than on the gratuitous instruction of a privileged class of youth. Mr. SMITH, of Maryland, remarked, that the arguments of the gentleman would well apply to a proposition to abolish this institution, but did not apply with any force to the question in hand, which was not the establishment of the Academy, but the appropriation of money to defray expenses already authorized by law.

Mr. CANNON was so little disposed to continue this establishment, that he was willing to arrest, or at least to reduce, the appropriation. But, in order to get at a proposition to reduce the expense of that establishment, or to abolish it, Mr. C. moved to lay this bill on the table.

After some observation from Mr. STROTHER in opposition to this motion, the question was taken thereon, and decided in the negative.

Mr. CANNON had proposed a sum less than that moved by the chairman of the Committee of Ways and Means for the support of the Military Academy. So that two questions were presented; the one on a certain sum necessary to the support of the academy as it now stands, and the other on a The question being taken, according to usage, on the largest amount, it was decided in the affirmative, by a large majority.

less sum.

Mr. CANNON said, he had entertained some doubts on the policy of keeping up this institution at the public expense; that, in answer to a resolution which he had introduced in the early part of the session, some information had been received from the War Department, from which he had learnt that something like one hundred and fifty thousand dollars was necessary for this institution the present year; that it had been in existence about twenty years, during the whole of which time it had been supported out of the Treasury of the United States, and that it had already cost us some millions of money. This he said, had led him to make some further inquiry about this expensive establishment, which he had heard it said was of so much public utility; and, in order to ascertain more precisely the whole amount of what it had already cost, and also the extent of public good that had been derived from it, he had introduced a

MARCH, 1820.

second resolution, requiring of the Secretary of War that information which he thought necessary to enable him to form a more correct opinion respecting the benefits that had, or would probably in future, accrue to this nation, by continuing to support this institution. But here, he regretted to have to say, he had been stopped by the decision of the House, which had rejected the resolution, and thereby prevented any further information be ing obtained on the subject. But, Mr. Chairman, said he, I recollect that some time during the 14th Congress, an honorable gentleman from Louisiana (Mr. ROBERTSON) brought before this House a proposition, the object of which was, to have the orphans of those who had fallen in the defence of their country during the late war, educated at this Military Academy, in preference to any others. I recollect also that this proposition met my warmest approbation; and I well remember the large majority by which it was at the same time rejected, and the benefits still retained for the wealthy part of the community, who, I have no doubt, are at this time enjoying almost exclusively the benefits and advantages of this institution. Nor, sir, have I yet forgotten that, during the present session, a proposition was rejected, which I had submitted to the House, to obtain some further support and protection to the orphans and widows of those gallant men who have fallen in defence of their country during the late war. Thus, sir, you have turned your back on the helpless orphan of your country's defender, while at the same time you are voting thousands for the education of the sons of the most wealthy part of the community; men who are able to educate their sons anywhere, without the assistance of Government. Is this right, I ask? is it just? is it not aristocracy, of the rankest order? For my own part, I can call it nothing else. He said he had made some calculation, from the little information he was allowed to obtain on this subject, from which it would appear that about two thousand dollars is bestowed on each of the cadets, who are admitted to this academy, and receive an education, when you have only given the helpless orphan of the patriot, whose life has been sacrificed in his country's defence, about twenty or thirty dollars each, and have refused to give more, but have left them to perish in infancy, or be supported, as is the case in many instances in our country, by the people of their neighborhood. Sir, said he, what must be the feelings of the patriot, whose blood has flown in his country's cause, when he shall look back on this state of things? Is this agreeable to the principles on which this Government was founded? Is it agreeable to the principles on which any government ought ever to be founded? I think not, said he; on the contrary, I believe it is the duty of this Government to extend support to the orphan of the country's defender, until that orphan shall be able to provide its own means of support. He had thought the Government was for the weak, and not the strong, as seems now to be the case." I have asked, said he, in vain, to know what benefits have been derived by this Government from this expensive Military Academy.

None have been able to point them out. If you intend to teach military science, it is here only confined to a few, "a privileged order," in our country, who never will, nor never have disseminated any of that science amongst the general mass of the people; and certainly it will not be pretended in this country that we are to confine the military science to such narrow limits; to give it to a few favorites, at the pubiic expense, and refuse it to all others.

Sir, said Mr. C., I believe that our Government has been pursuing the wrong course upon this subject. The military science that has been taught at public expense, he said, ought, in his opinion, to be taught to the officers of the militia, from whom it would be imparted to the citizens generally, the soldiers on whom we must forever depend. This, he said, had never yet been attempted, nor did he believe it ever would be attempted, until this system of privileged military order, and military aristocracy, was pulled down, or put out of existence.

Sir, said he, when you are asked a pittance to support and educate a helpless infant orphan of him whose blood has crimsoned your fields of battle in defence of his country, your ears are deaf to the call, and it is regarded with indifference! But, sir, when thousands are called for, for this Military Academy, (for the benefit of the wealthy,) your sensibilities are awakened, and your feelings are alive to their interests; and numerous advocates are crowding into the debate, and even the emptiness of your Treasury is not an obstacle. What, sir! does this look like the principles of justice and equality? he thought not. He said, he did not intend to go into an inquiry about the manner in which this institution had been conducted, nor any irregularities and misconduct that has been so loudly complained of, and which had loaded our tables with such a mass of pamphlets? nor did he mean to make any reflection on any gentleman, who had heretofore, or might hereafter, obtain the education of his son, or sons, at this Military Academy at the public expense? nor did he mean any reflection on any of the cadets, or young men who had received an education there, or were now enjoying its benefits. He thought, so long as it is kept up at the expense of the Government, that it was fair, and not improper in any individual to enjoy its benefits who has it in his power to do so for he knew very well, that it was out of the power of the poorest part of the people of our country to obtain any portion of its benefits, and that was one of the strong objections he felt to this institution. It was supported by the funds of the nation-drawn from public lands, and various other sources from which we derive revenue-these funds as much belonged to the poor as to the rich. But when placed in this Military Academy, the benefits cannot, have not, nor will they ever be equally shared between them, but must be obtained almost exclusively by the rich, who are entirely competent to educate their sons without this public assistance. Sir, said he, if this institution could be made a school for the education of the orphans of our country of

H. of R.

whom he had spoken, he would he willing to support it? But, instead of that, it is a system by which the poor are robbed, in order to add to the splendor of the rich. He had no doubt some of these cadets would go into the public service provided you make officers of them; but he believed but few would, under any circumstance, serve their country as soldiers. And keep this system up, and it leads to this, that the whole of the profitable or desirable appointments of our Army or Navy are to be taken from these highly favored young men, to the exclusion of all others, no matter what their qualifications may be. He considered such establishments of aristocracy dangerous to the liberties of the people, and the principles of the Government. But he was well aware of the situation any member of this House stood in, that attempts their destruction. He was aware of the growing disposition of the Government towards aristocracy, and was anxious to check it; he thought the sooner, the better. For, said he, if you retain this institution, and add one or two more of a similar character, it will be in vain to attempt to arrest the course of our Government towards aristocracy. It will become so, and perhaps something worse will follow.

Sir, said he, the honorable gentleman who is chairman of the Committee of Ways and Means, (Mr. SMITH, of Maryland) who reported the bill containing this appropriation, objects to the course I am taking, and says it is not the proper way to effect the object I have in view. Indeed, sir, I fear no course that can be taken by me to effect my object, will meet the approbation of that gentleman; for, sir, it is my object to abolish this Military Academy entirely, to prevent its being any longer kept up at public expense. And I had supposed, to withhold the appropriation, would have that effect, and in the event the House determined to refuse the appropriation, he would then take the other steps that would be necessary, after such decision was made. This, he said, was the object he had in view, and he had made the motion to strike out this appropriation, in order to ascertain the sense of the House on the subject. He hoped, therefore, that the Committee would now make the decision.

The Committee proceeded to the other items of appropriation.

The item of $21,000 for bounties and premiums on enlistments of recruits to fill up the Army coming up

Mr. WILLIAMS, of North Carolina, opposed this item, on the ground that there was no necessity for increasing the number of the Army beyond their present actual amount.

Mr. SMITH, of Maryland, supported the appropriation as being almost a matter of course, and generally on the ground that the Army ought not to be reduced at all; but, if reduced, that it ought to be by a direct vote.

Mr. TRIMBLE declared himself in favor of a reduction of the Army, but in a practicable way; and he thought that to attempt it in this way would but serve to weaken the efforts which should hereafter be made directly to effect the same object.