Mr. Hobhoufe afked if perfons would be forced to ferve under

this Bill?

Mr. Dundas faid "No."

Mr. Tierney faid, that fo far from intending to oppose the plan, he highly approved of it, and he fhould have contented himtelf with giving a filent vote, and not have faid a word on the fubject, if a difpofition had been fhewn that day to leave out of the queftion all party prejudices. An Honourable Gentleman, however, on the other fide of the House, whofe reputation for a meek and peaceable difpofition might lead one to suppose that he would have purfued a different conduct, had, in the most unprovoked manner, thrown out ungrounded affertions againft Gentlemen on that fide of the Houfe, by faying that they had made a fecret oppofition to the intended plan, at the time they openly expreffed their approbation of it. Whatever others might think, he, for his part, would fay, that, the language and illiberal infinuations he had heard, were fuch as he might naturally expect to come from that quarter.---" I will tell that Honourable Gentleman, (faid Mr. Tierney) that I am as animated in the caufe of defending my country, and that I am as true a friend to the interefts of Great Britain as he can be. I have a character to maintain as well as he. I have a right to fay that my reputation is as good, and that I and my friends are as much entitled to credit, both from this House and the country." But for that Honourable Gentleman to fay, that any thing had fallen from his friends which called for the most diftant animadverfion, was a thing which he could not be warranted in doing. One Honourable Friend of his, a military officer, whofe military talents, upon his honour, he refpected, thought it right to throw out his ideas, upon what he conceived beft to be done. Whether what he fuggefted was right or wrong, he could not take upon himself to determine; but fo far from deferving any freer, the Honourable General merited applause, unless it could be fhewn his advice was the offfpring of improper motives. Another Honourable Gentleman, a friend of his, had advifed conciliation with Ireland. As to what had fallen from an Honourable Friend of his, he believed that it would be agreeable to the general cordiality fo much re commended, to receive the fuggeftions which he had offered to the Houfe. Could any Gentleman fuppofe that thefe fuggef tions were like a fecret oppofition. Surely when any Gentle man ftates what he thinks to be most adviseable, that inan muit indeed be a lukewarm friend to his country, who, giving way to the petulance of his nature, would indulge a Ineer at fuch efforts. "I fay, now, that I give the prefent measure my diftinct approbation, withing to fee what it is. But, as a Member of No. 20. Parliament

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Parliament, I will neither be frightened nor deterred from ftating any obfervations, even in oppofition to the plan, if I fhould fee fufficient grounds for fo doing. And I think I may fay that the Right Honourable Gentleman, in whom the plan originated, will feel difpofed rather to thank me for my fuggef tions, than to receive them with fpleen and ill-will."

Mr. Wilberforce hoped, after what had been faid by Mr. Tierney, that he might be permitted to go a little beyond the ftrict limits of explanation. He really could not account for the feverity of remark which that Honourable Gentleman had ufed, in any other way than this: that as opportunities for venting their fpleen did not now often occur in the Houfe, it of courfe collected and accumulated, till at last it burft forth without provocation, and

The Speaker called Mr. Wilberforce to order, as not having confined himfelf to explanation.

Mr. Wilberforce acknowledged the propriety of being called to order, and declared, that if any thing he had faid could deferve fuch severity of animadverfion, he was forry that he had faid it. It certainly was neither in his intention nor his difpofition. He had declared, that he was rather difpofed to take a part, because the language held did not appear to be warm and cordial fupport; and because he wifhed the plan to be attended to, as the public out of doors were impatient that it should be adopted. More he would not fay, because he would not tranfgrefs the limits of explanation. Indeed he did not doubt that the Honourable Gentleman, when he made his remarks, knew that he could not reply to them, and that, perhaps, night urge him to make them."

The Chancellor of the Exchequer." Sir, I feel myself called upon to exprefs my aftonifhment at the language thrown out by the Honourable Gentlemen on the other fide of the House against my Honourable Friend near me. I have no difficulty in faying, that it is the moft unprovoked and unwarrantable attack I have ever heard made by one Gentleman upon another. With refpect to myself, I can eafily account for what my Honourable Friend has faid: the fentiments which he has expreffed have been unquestionably dictated by the pureft and the moft patriotic motives. He exprefled his belief that the great body of the people of this country were impatient 'to ftep forward and carry into execution thofe plans which the wildom of the Legislature might adopt for the more effectual protection and fafety of the kingdom, and on that ground he was defirous that any falutary plans or fyftem of defence which might be propofed, fhould be received with unanimity, and confirmed with the moft marked and decided approbation of every Member, for in that moft effential

effential point all are equally concerned. It is therefore rather extraordinary, because my Honourable Friend complained that certain Members did not give their hearty fupport to the meafures proposed to be carried into execution with refpect to the defence of the country, that the Honourable Gentlemen on the other fide of the Houfe fhould get up and make a direct and violent attack against my Honourable Friend, as if the Honourable Gentleman was convinced that the infinuation had been thrown out against himself. What it is that has fo unexpectedly kindled the flame of refentment in the Honourable Gentleman's breaft, and raifed his paffions to this aggreffion, I am at a lofs to conjecture; but I muft afk, has my Honourable Friend had no caule for throwing out any blame againft certain perfons this day? Has he been furnished with no ground for delivering his fentiments in the way which he has thought proper to adopt? The Honourable General certainly has not been fo warm in the important caufe of the defence of the country as my Honourable Friend, and, I am confident, many others, may have wifhed: for, though he has not objected to the plan now under difcuffion, one may with great confiftency fuppofe that his opinion in favour of it is too lukewarm. The Honourable General has faid, there is fomething which ought to come first, and that the whole force of the kingdom fhould be concentrated at the metropolis. I am not difpofed to difcufs military difpofition, nor do I hold this a proper place to do fo; but it is fomewhat obfervable that this concentration of the military ftrength of the kingdom is to be understood as laid down by the Honourable Gentleman himfelf, with confiderable limitations, with the exceptions of confiderable detachments in the North, the South, at Newcastle, Liverpool, Bristol, and, though he did not mention them particularly, I fuppofe at Plymouth, Portsmouth, and all other ftrong ports and commercial towns on the coaft. This, then, supplies an additional argument for employing the whole mass of the people, and therefore my Honourable Friend might well exprefs furprise that the measure for putting that mafs into circulation did not meet the Honourable Gentleman's warm support. The Honourable Gentleman has alfo objected to driving the country, on the ground that it was not carried into effect in America. But why it was not carried into effect in America, or that fuch a measure, if it could be effected here, would not materially annoy an invading enemy, he has not condefcended to inform us.

"As to what has been thrown out by an Honourable Gentleman on the fubject of conciliation with refpect to Ireland, and the reference which he has thought proper to make in his obfervations on that topic to the prefent fituation of Switzer

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land,

land, I cannot help remarking that the allufion is one of the ftrangeft which I have ever heard made; and my Honourable Friend might have been well furprised at the inference which the Honourable Gentleman drew from it, because the inference ought in fact to be directly the reverfe of the conclufion which the Honourable Gentleman took fuch pains to establish. The fame Honourable Gentleman has reprobated, in the moft pointed and unqualified terms, the prefent fyftem of coercion which unfortunately has become necessary for Ireland, and has compared the ftate of this country with that in which Switzerland has been hitherto placed. He has endeavoured to fhew, that the want of unanimity among the people of that confederacy has produced thofe misfortunes in which they are at prefent involved, and has thus laboured to prove that fimilar calamities impend over this country. But, Sir, the Honourable Gentleman thould know that the British Parliament and the British Government, during the whole of his prefent Majefty's reign, fo far as they had the power of interfering in the affairs of Ireland, have fhewn every indulgence, and granted every poffible favour to that country. He fhould know, that nothing has been omitted on their part, and that no exertion has been wanting to extend the commerce, and fecure the rights, privileges, and happiness of that kingdom. Conciliation is now become a favourite word; but I beg leave to fay, that the word conciliation, in the prefent crifis of public affairs, is both misunderstood and mifapplied. Does the Honourable Gentleman mean, by conciliation to Ireland, that we should make every conceffion and every facrifice to traitors and rebels, to men who are industriously propagating the most dangerous principles, engrafting upon the minds of the people the most deftructive doctrines, wantonly feducing and deluding the ignorant multitude, encouraging the moft criminal correlpondence with the enemy, exciting the commission of treafon in Ireland under the fpecious pretence of parliamentary reform, and forming, in conjunction and co-operation with the profeffed enemy of all liberty, morality, and focial happiness, plans for feparating that country from Great Britain, and for converting Ireland into a Jacobinical Republic, under the wing and protection of Republican France? Are we to conciliate men whofe machinations go not merely to the fubverfion of their legitimate government, but to the diffufion of every horror that anarchy can produce? Are we to conciliate men with arms in their hands, ready to plunge them into the hearts of those who differ from them in political opinion; men who are eagerly watching for an opportunity to overturn the whole fabric of their Conftitution, and to crufh their countrymen with its ruins? Are we to withhold from the peaceable

and loyal inhabitants of Ireland that protection without which there is no fecurity for their lives and property? No! The only measure of fafety we can adopt is a vigorous system of oppofition to thofe who would completely deftroy the country; while, on the other hand, we are irrefiftibly called upon to give a manly and firm fupport to thofe who would preferve for themselves and their poterity, thofe great and ineftimable bleffings which they now enjoy

"Since an allufion has been made to Switzerland, I think it neceffary to obferve, that her prefent calamities have been produced by the adoption of measures directly contrary to those which I have juft mentioned. She unfortunately gave way at an early period of the war, to the fatal influence of French democracy. She afterwards confented to new model her Government, and endeavoured, but in vain, to appease the enemy. Her condefcenfion was ineffectual--her conceffions were difregarded;---her attempt at conciliation was fruitless. The enemy was regardless of every conceffion, and intent alone upon gratifying the imperious calls of unbounded ambition. But if the Swils had from the beginning purfued a manly and decided line of conduct; if they had oppofed vigorous measures to the deftructive principles of France, and kept themfelves in a state of independence and ftrict neutrality, they would, I believe, be at this moment as free as any other nation; though I ftill fincerely hope their refiftance is not too late. If therefore any inference with respect to the prefent fituation of this country is drawn. from the misfortunes of Switzerland, the example of the miferies which he has fuffered in confequence of her timidity, furely ought to weigh with us; the patriotic heroifm and gallant ardour now difplayed by her brave inhabitants, ought to animate us to the most vigorous exertions, and convince us, fince we behold the extraordinary efforts of which a nation is capable, even with all that fupinenefs into which fhe has been betrayed, and reduced as she is to her laft ftruggle, that we have every thing to hope from our perfeverance, firmness and unanimity. I trust, Sir, that the example of that brave, but unhappy pcople, will animate this country to vigorous and neceffary exertion. Let us not, by imitating their former conduct, run into the danger in which they have involved themfelves, and fubject ourfelves to incur thofe misfortunes which they now experience." • Leave was given to bring in the Bill.

Mr. Dundas faid, that as it was neceffary to have it carried through all its ftages with every poffible difpatch, he would now move that the Bill be printed. Ordered.

Mr. Ryder moved for a ftring of papers relative to the herring-fishery, which were ordered to be prefented.---Adjourned.

HOUSE